OoT / MQ Trick Research & Discovery Thread

[nathanisbored]

I think it's stupid too, but maybe we need to reorganize the wrong warp pages to include void warping. Maybe it can be categorized as:

Wrong Warp
-----Offset Wrong Warping (deku, DC, fire wrong warps)
-----Blue Warp CS skip (forest, water, shadow, spirit wrong warps)
-----Wrong Coordinates  (void warp)

since all three of these count as WWs in speedrun categories

EDIT: oh my, I didn't realize how much work had been done to the wrong warp pages... this is going to be harder than I thought

[nathanisbored]

To activate the Ocarina of Time cutscene where Ganondorf chases Zelda out of the castle, you need to have all 3 spiritual stones right? So even using Odd Potion BA, the only way to get certain items on B is to wrong warp into the song of time cutscene, to avoid Zora's Sapphire and at least one other spiritual stone (the RBA modifiers can't avoid these).

EDIT: Apparently items values 97, 101, and 113 are still impossible to get on B. At least, it appears that way.

[Exodus122]

I found a neat heart piece trick that has some strange effects.

Have more than 3 Heart Pieces:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-8TVyCW_Bg

which can be used to do this:

Heart Piece Text Glitch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMeOt1X4CmI

[GAP]

I had been wodnering about the Kokiri Sword thing even if you start the glitch, could you skip all the sequences and go to Adult Link early?

[nathanisbored]

Farore's Wind anywhere (that has a ladder or vine) as Child:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-c4u2L5EVmg

So.... have fun!

[mzxrules]

More like unrestricted items is possible with down a.

[Kimimaru]

I had been wodnering about the Kokiri Sword thing even if you start the glitch, could you skip all the sequences and go to Adult Link early?

What are you referring to? It is possible to escape the Forest and immediately go to the Temple of Time and get the Master Sword, with or without the Kokiri Sword, if that's what you were wondering.

[Exodus122]

Spirit Trial bombchu chest as child without beamos hover
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U60ReFtzQtQ


Also, I did some research on how eggs hatch because I was curious why they don't hatch on B. This is a rough explanation I formulated using some logic and testing, and it's possible this is not EXACTLY how it works. All of the tests I did supported it though.

First, each of the inventory slots is checked for value 33 (Weird Egg), starting with the Deku Stick Slot and ending on the Child Trade Slot.
When a Weird Egg is found, that slot is then changed to value 34 (Chicken) and the rest of the slots are not changed, even if they also had a Weird Egg. Next, each of the 3 C-Buttons is checked from left to right for value 33 (Weird Egg), and when one is found it is updated to Chicken. The remaining C-buttons are not changed.

If no Weird Egg was found, the same checking and updating process happens for the Pocket Egg instead.

Theories:
-As long as you have a Weird Egg in your inventory, the Pocket Eggs in your inventory will never hatch.
-If you have more than one egg of the same type on your c-buttons (possible with Trade Item Duplication), the c-left one will hatch first, then c-down, and finally c-right .
-Eggs on C-buttons will only hatch if there is also one of the same type in your inventory. This means that if you RBA Green Potion when you have your Pocket Egg equipped, this pocket egg on c will not hatch, because it will be gone from your inventory.
-If you have multiple eggs of any type in your inventory, only one will hatch each day. The Weird Egg in the lowest slot will hatch and if there are no Weird eggs, the Pocket Egg in the lowest slot will hatch.
-Eggs on B don't hatch because the B-button is not checked like the c-buttons are.

[r0bd0g]

I was thinking for Down A RI in the Fire Temple, maybe it would be better if you OI the warp and then quickly did Down A, instead of doing Down A and then hovering up. Maybe somebody could look into that?

EDIT: Cafde did it here's a video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RyLNSXBDws

[Steve]

I was thinking for Down A RI in the Fire Temple, maybe it would be better if you OI the warp and then quickly did Down A, instead of doing Down A and then hovering up. Maybe somebody could look into that?

It is possible to get down A and still be on the ground after oi, so it should be possible to do ri this way.

[mzxrules]

I decided to study Gohma's A.I. a bit for it's boss page, and found a few interesting things. Others helped confirm what items can/can't be used against Gohma during certain phases.

• Gohma appears to have (for lack of a better term) two A.I patterns that affect how the stun mechanic works: one for crawling on the ground (floor state), and one for crawling up the ceiling (ceiling state)
• When in the floor state, Gohma can always be stunned by Deku Nuts, and the only other item that can stun Gohma is the slingshot when it's eye is red. Also, re-stunning appears to only work while Gohma is in the floor state.
• When in the ceiling state, Gohma appears to be immune to Deku Nuts. When Gohma's eye turns red while on the ceiling, Gohma can be stunned by any attack except the Megaton Hammer's "ground shake" ability, and Deku Nuts. Din's Fire can knock Gohma down, but it appears that the spell doesn't reach high enough (feel free to experiment on this, I tried it maybe 5 times)
• Gohma changes from floor state to ceiling state whenever one of these occurs: The path between Gohma and Link is obstructed by a pillar (Gohma will simply climb up it), or Gohma exits the stun state having taken damage. Interestingly, if damage Gohma but you re-stun her and don't deal damage she will stay in the floor state.
• Gohma changes from ceiling state to floor state only when the three Gohma Larva she spawns are killed. Or in other words, if you somehow screw up hilariously on Gohma hover, you'll have to kill the larva to give it another go.
• On the floor, Gohma stays stunned for ~40 frames, or 2 seconds. If knocked off the ceiling, Gohma stays stunned for ~144 frames, or 7 seconds

[Exodus122]

GTG Key dupe without Longshot http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCjfgIJf8bw

[r0bd0g]

I just read where people were saying that people thought WW and wrong coordinates warp were essentially the same glitch? Well... they are? Wrong Warp, Blue Warp CS skip, Void Warp and Death Hole are all different effects of the same glitch: Triggering two loading zones one after the other. The 2nd loading zone is always the one that is actually carried out, except in the case where the 2nd loading zone is triggered on the last possible frame, in which case the 1st loading zone goes through as planned. Whichever loading zone isn't carried out can have effects that bleed through into the one that is. If the inactive loading zone gave you items or set dungeon completion flags, it's a CS skip (EDIT: Apparently you can get these at a point prior to doing a CS Skip, but that's not really the point). If it used particular coordinates (falling OoB or using FW), it's a Void Warp. If it set a cutscene offset it's a Wrong Warp. If it was quitting the game, you get beta quest (quitting can also be the active loading zone to get beta quest, as long as the inactive loading zone sets a cutscene offset). If this all being essentially the same glitch is the reason that all those things are covered by "no wrong warp", then you might want to be wary of ever doing the death hole glitch in these categories; since it does set an exit value, it might qualify, even though there are no noticeable effects.

Anyway I discovered that you can do Down A RI on ladders just by being swordless, getting on the ladder, equipping over something you can use, and then mashing the button as you climb off the top or bottom of a ladder. However, the game seems to think you're in the air when you do this, and using a cutscene-based item while in the air like that causes softlocks. There are only two ladders in the game that I found where it doesn't softlock, the reason being I think because you go slightly into the ground as you climb off of them. Those are the ladder in Hyrule Field closest to Lake Hylia, and the ladder in Zora's Domain. For the ladder in ZD, you MUST get on it at the bottom; if you climb it down from the top it doesn't work. Here's a video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsduDtAsNUs

So the reason that WW RI works is because your scene setup is set to a value of 4 or higher. These are values normally reserved for cutscenes. There is actually one place in the entire game where the game doesn't warp away after such a cutscene, allowing you to use restricted items without actually having to WW. Unfortunately it's impossible to actually have any items at this point in the game, lol. It's the intro cutscene. You can tell it's happening because that first time in Link's House, your C buttons aren't dimmed. Technically you can wrong warp into that cutscene. I guess this is the only time you can use WW RI to recast FW and get a unique entrance. Of course that entrance WW's right back into the intro CS lol.

[nathanisbored]

Apparently entering the Ganon fight unsets that "have equipped a sword before" flag. So if you've equipped the Kokiri sword, then you enter the Ganon fight, and then savewarp, you will keep blank B, and I imagine you can do the Ingo horse minigame BS to get stick on B as well (although I haven't confirmed this).

Entering the Ganon fight also reverses the bit for the MS in the inventory, so if you have the MS going into the battle, you won't during the battle, and if you don't have it going in, you will (obviously this was already known). This also means you can savewarp during the battle as adult without restoring MS to B on 1.1 or 1.2.

Also, unrelated to the Ganon fight, I'm pretty sure that any time you savewarp with a non-sword item on B, the game will automatically reverse the bit for whichever sword in the inventory is highlighted. This explains why exodus' trick to get the kokiri sword in the inventory without opening the chest works, and it also explains quickswap sword deletion (although bottle duping really has nothing to do with it). It also means as long as no sword is highlighted, you won't delete any swords upon savewarping. If you go back and forth through time after deleting MS, it will put MS back in the inventory, but it won't highlight it (again, most of this was already known, but w/e). Interestingly, it doesn't cause Adult Reset unless you actually have blank B, which means the Adult Reset page is wrong.

[r0bd0g]

I heard from Nathan you could do the ladder RI softlock with WW RI so I decided to see if you could use RI to use items in the water.

So when you go into the water with RI, Link doesn't put the items away. So you can use them if you shield swipe. The first-person items also work while swimming. This wasn't possible before with RCE RI because you can't use the shield in RCE. There's a few more oddities that aren't really worth mentioning. Not really sure what uses this could have. Maybe there's some stuff in the water temple could be done without lowing the water, IDK.