Allowing RBA for 100%

[Zargaroc]

yeah, RG give a interesting point to this

[quo]

I don't think anyone is actually against this (to my surprise), I'm for it personally since I don't see why it was banned in the first place but that's in the past (or it will be in the past. so it's in the present? idk)

For the bottle issue, I still say you need to get them legit instead of RBAing NL/red pot/empty bottle because in that case, what would stop you from RBAing other items? You could easily get free HPs and medallions, ammo upgrades, equipment, etc.

I vote against having items appear in you inventory, but, as I mentioned, banning RBA just cause isn't the most compelling argument. It would still be useful for things like chu count and BAing pig poes for last bottle.

[UchihaSasuke]

RBA could be usable as long as none of the needed items get affected by it.

like, use RBA to increase item counts of things like Bombchus but don't use it to get extra bottles (get all bottles through their sidequests)

there wouldn't be much use of RBA in 100% due to how it can mess up the inventory if you try some of the more beneficial RBAs (can't RBA any of the items that don't come back)

[Zas]

If you RBA poe bottle the poe hunter still has a bottle unobtained so clearly you're not at 100%. Same applies to ruto's letter and milk. And if i remember right obtaining a 5th bottle gets put in the first bottle slot so your RBA'd bottles would remain RBA'd.

[nathanisbored]

Yeah I agree with Zas. RBAing for bottles in bottle slots makes it impossible to 100% anymore, because even if you get all the bottles legit at that point, the last one doesn't get put in the right slot. I still think RBA is fine, but may be end up fairly limited because of side effects like this.

[r0bd0g]

If RBA/BA is to be reallowed, that would likely mean Ganonless would be used in 100%.
I feel like that was a major factor in the decision to ban it?

That said, has anybody bothered to check for sure that Ganonless is currently slower? Currently you would have to use either RCE or Down A/Ladder RI to set FW at a place that WW's to Nocturne, use Collection Delay to duplicate the Eyeball Frog so you can trade it and use it as a timer both, then timer WW to Gohma, FWWW to Nocturne, and then finish with another RI FW and WW to credits. It takes a fair amount of time to set up and monopolizes all 3 WW's, but skips all of Ganon's Tower (and part of the Nocturne CS too, I guess).

One weird thing is that, though it's technically possible (might not be reasonable to do it, as I think it would either involve never equipping a sword or saving inside the water temple or something) to get swordless with quickdraw, but it would currently be disallowed as you have to go through bottle to get there.

[nathanisbored]

If RBA/BA is to be reallowed, that would likely mean Ganonless would be used in 100%.

We could just go the All Dungeons route and say that Ganon is required. It's not a very arbitrary decision, considering the category IS 100% (which aims to complete a bunch of objectives that aren't required anyway). In fact, I think it would be simple enough to just add "All Bosses" to the 100% definition. The current route fights them all right? So nothing would be obsoleted.

[r0bd0g]

100% is defined by items you have to obtain, and Ganon gives you nothing. I'd be very-much against this change.

Also, OoT3D has been doing Ganonless in 100% for a long time now...

[ZFG]

I'm extremely against allowing wrong warp to the credits in 100%.  No, ganon doesn't actually give you anything, but it seems incredibly stupid to skip the final boss in a category based on completion.

[nathanisbored]

100% is defined by items you have to obtain, and Ganon gives you nothing. I'd be very-much against this change.

Also, OoT3D has been doing Ganonless in 100% for a long time now...

All Dungeons is part of the 100% definition, even though the dungeons aren't items. Yes, they give you items, but completing the dungeons is a separate requirement. If you got all stones and medallions through other means (for example if RBA wasn't banned), you'd still have to beat them anyway. 100% isn't really just about items, although you're right, is is primarily about items.

EDIT: Oh whoops! I guess All Dungeons isn't currently part of the definition. Either I'm crazy, or the definition was rewritten somewhere down the line or something. But anyway, I think All Dungeons should be a requirement simply because they are major progression points in the story. Same could be said about fighting Ganon. Call it arbitrary if you'd like, but 100% is an entirely subjective category anyway, since percentages are not defined by the game.