Author Topic: Wii 100% with EMS  (Read 4053 times)

Offline Habreno

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 49
Wii 100% with EMS
« on: March 13, 2016, 09:35:33 PM »
It was brought up to me that I should look into this and see how close it ends up being to GC. And so I am. The route is heavily WIP (and absolutely frying my brain cells), and is up to Midna's Desperate Hour.


So here's what I've found out so far:

1: EMS is hard as hell to route. The trick itself? Easy. Untangling the massive knot it makes of the game logic? Hard.

2: Wii also has Early HP inside Lakebed Temple. It does require going up to 2F (Wii has to go to 2F anyway for early-ish Deku Toad). This averts one of the major slowdowns, that being having to have activated both water towers in order to get the HP inside the Single Cog Room. It can be done without the Clawshot as well.
-- What you do is on the ledge on the same side of the room on 2F, hang of the ledge and move left, until you are forcibly dropped by running out of ledge. You'll land on the platform with the pot.
-- Turn wolf, and dash off the platform aimed directly at the edge. You'll grab it and pull yourself up. [[Can you make the jump as human? Untested]]
-- Boomerang the pot, and put it on the switch.
-- Claim your heart piece.

3: I have no clue if the route is still able to be completed. It *should* be doable. I'm currently saved immediately after MDH (other saves: prior to stealing Iza's Bomb Bag, after Eldin Twilight), and I'll start figuring out where and how to go from here.
-- BoE warp should be active once I complete Goron Mines; the rocks were blown up prior to completing Lakebed.
-- Even though I've gotten the Ball and Chain, Ashei should still spawn after completing Arbiter's Grounds since if I recall correctly that's the trigger for her appearance.
-- The basic plan is to do the dungeons in relatively the same order as GC.

When I actually have some semblanace of a route completed I'll post it up. In the meantime, if someone knows some of the dependencies that affect 100%, please post them here, just to have a better reference.

Offline Habreno

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 49
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2016, 12:25:52 AM »
Good news: The route is doable. You can, in fact, beat Wii 1.0 with EMS while attaining 100% requirements.

Great news: Cave of Ordeals is laughably easy. It's probably going to take like 8 minutes. Not joking. And you can still get like 600R out of it too.

Meh news: The route as a whole is probably crappy. I'll be tweaking it over the next few days. But, there is a route (of sorts).

Bad news: Rupee route sucks. Like, terribly bad.


https://pastebin.com/04wcZLUY - Just as a reminder, this is a *semblance* of a route. It's not strictly complete, but if you fill in the missing stuff (listed below) you're okay. I will be finishing and polishing it.
City, Palace, and Hyrule Castle are not written in yet, and rupee counts aren't figured out near the end of the run. Plus I don't know if Coro bottle is in there or not. If you're looking for a route to run, I'd suggest waiting a few days. If you're looking for a route to look at, go right ahead, it sucks.


Rough dungeon order:

Forest Temple
Lakebed (to Ooccoo)
Snowpeak (to Ball and Chain)
Lakebed Temple
Arbiter's Grounds
Goron Mines
Snowpeak Complete
Temple of Time
Cave of Ordeals (is this even a dungeon anymore lol)
City in the Sky
Palace of Twilight
Hyrule Castle

Alternatively, if the Helmasaur LJA is too hard, you can just get Snowpeak Ooccoo instead while you're getting the Ball and Chain. It's a little slower but doable.



Finally. Re: Early HP in Lakebed. Not doable as Human, it's an EMS route trick only (sadface). Human doesn't quite have the speed to make the jump, and it's impossible to LJA with no enemies. Also, the clawshot target is out of range.



Just for some documentation in a relatively close spot (none of this was found by me):

GC style Map Glitch on Wii - Firstly, head to the Options menu and enable Icon Shortcuts.
In-game: While holding Z, put the pointer over the Map button in the bottom-right corner of the screen, then press A, B, and Up on the D-pad simultaneously. Warp somewhere on the map. Midna will come up and cancel out the warp, giving you map glitch.

Cave of Ordeals Floor Skips - Gale Boomerang the torches on the floor you're on. It opens the door on the next floor down (you boomerang the torches on F2, it opens the door on F3).
Required Floors (cannot be skipped): 1, 2, 10, 11, 20, 21, 30, 31, 40, 41



What do I think time can get down to? Probably within an hour of GC, maybe even within 30 minutes if optimized and run by someone better than I am.

Cons vs GC:
-- Not having Boomerang LJAs lose like 50 minutes if I had to guess.
-- No BiT/BiTE loses not much.
-- Mailman triggers being different in Hyrule Field West (East on GC) costs however long the mailman takes (hitting the vines doesn't cancel out the mailman triggers on Wii 1.0).

Pros vs GC:
-- Floor skips in CoO saves like 15 minutes. I'm going to guess CoO will be about 6-8 minutes compared to 22-23 minutes on GC.
-- Pointer aiming saves some time, especially in menuing.
-- Four equips vs two saves time.
-- Warping underwater saves like 10 seconds the one time we do it.

Changes vs GC:
-- Mailman skips and Ooccoo skip in ToT possible without Boomerang LJAs, because of smaller triggers.

Offline Habreno

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 49
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2016, 11:59:36 PM »
Good news: First test route was sub-9.

https://pastebin.com/jn51wS6e


There's three different ways you can get Ooccoo and the Ball and Chain. All three are in the route, in order from fastest to slowest. These changes affect the Snowpeak Ruins dungeon and the Lakebed Temple dungeon, and the differences are noted.

Go have fun. I'll be working on tweaking as time goes on.

Offline Habreno

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 49
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2016, 04:37:47 PM »
Been working on tweaking and testing. Updated route: https://pastebin.com/XYnbXKU7

Two main considerations for route, both included in the route: Lakebed Ooccoo or Snowpeak Ooccoo. The latter isn't that much slower (maybe a minute or two) but is more consistent. Both routes get bombs before ball and chain, since that route inside Snowpeak is faster.

Another sub-consideration is which CitS route to do after the Double Clawshots savewarp - both routes are within 15s of each other on Wii and each has a difficult trick. Reverse CitS is slower but failing the Dynalfos Helm Splitter is less costly than failing the Peahat LJA.

Offline Habreno

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 49
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2016, 09:14:01 AM »
Currently working on testing route changes. New route would be very similar to GC route (intentionally, why reinvent the wheel?) up to ToT, and significant diversion from there. The route is Lakebed Ooccoo based; I may work on a Snowpeak Ooccoo Route as I understand the difficulty of Helmasaur LJA.

Importantly, the route is USA Wii 1.0 only, as the Floor Skips in Cave of Ordeals only work on that version.


Monkey Skip in Forest Temple is our main glitch-find consideration.

Offline aterraformer

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 24
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2016, 12:36:15 PM »
Is there a way to tell what version a disc is by just looking at it or the casing, like a cartridge or is it just if the trick works?

Offline Habreno

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 49
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2016, 01:08:06 AM »
It's on the back side of the disc, near the hole in the center. Hold the disc up to the light to see it better.

US Wii 1.0 looks like this:

RVL-RZDE-0A-0

RVL: Revolution (Wii's codename)
RZDE: R for Revolution (later games in the Wii's lifespan also used an S); ZD is the game code (ZD specifically being for Twilight Princess); E is US (P would be PAL and J would be JPN)
0A-0: Not sure what the 0A is for, but the 0 at the end indicates the version number. 0 for 1.0; 2 would be 1.2


You can also test if specific tricks work; to my knowledge the Floor skips in Cave of Ordeals are exclusive to the USA Wii 1.0 version.

Offline aterraformer

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 24
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2016, 11:28:29 PM »
Damn, I have 1.2

Offline Habreno

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 49
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2016, 11:54:11 PM »
If you're willing to do some testing, there's a few things that I'm curious about seeing if they work on 1.2 (I don't have a 1.2 disc myself, else I'd simply test them personally). Note that these are all Wii exclusive glitches or Wii exclusive methods.

Underwater Warping: While standing underwater with Iron Boots on (and otherwise satisfy warping requirements as human), pull up the map and try to warp.
If it works, you'll simply warp. If you can't activate portals, then it doesn't work. A good place to test this is the underwater HP behind the Eldin Spring.
I'm not expecting this to work.

Fast Walking on Magnetic Ceilings: While being pulled to a magnet beam, and Link is not underwater, pull up the Items menu and force-unequip the Iron Boots.
If it works, you'll get pulled to the destination and be able to run around at normal movement speed on the surface. If you drop as soon as you leave the Items menu, then it doesn't work. A good place to test this is in Goron Mines, after getting the first key shard.
I have no clue if this will work or not, but I'm leaning towards it not.

Midna Dive: This is a bit trickier to explain, so I'm simply going to recommend you look at the trick on ZSR.
If it works, you fall while Midna's talking to you. If it doesn't, it's just like GC in that the item doesn't push you but you push the item.
Once again, no clue if this will work or not.

Mailman Skips on Wii: In short, every mailman trigger on Wii (at least 1.0) is small enough that you can jump attack over it. As human or wolf.
If it works, you can just jump attack over the mailman trigger. If not, HEEEEEEEEY! A great place to test this is the Castle Town bridge mailman trigger, as it's a well-known trigger and small.
This has potential to still work on 1.2.


If you are going to run Wii, I would highly recommend picking up the USA 1.0 version.

Offline Habreno

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 49
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2016, 12:00:43 AM »
Might move the last bit of night cycle but this is what we've come up with (dragonbane's been helping with routing and tricks; DF's been helping with bomb boosts and tricks, plus credit has to go to everyone involved in the GC route as that is what this is based off)

https://pastebin.com/WqBeG93z

It's not perfect but it's a lot better than it used to be.

Offline Habreno

  • Regular Guay
  • Posts: 49
Re: Wii 100% with EMS
« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2016, 12:33:12 PM »
Fixed a couple things, moved the final night cycle, and generally improved rupee routing.

https://pastebin.com/ZF1AMXxu