Author Topic: Super Jumping (Big Ups)  (Read 43895 times)

Offline Drenn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #40 on: March 20, 2015, 01:00:25 PM »
I intended more to clarify the idea of "don't go to another screen by there" than "you can't walk on these very tiles".
Okay, fair enough... In this case it starts to look like my previous idea for "no wrong warp" where you can't transition between 2 spots that shouldn't be connected. Not quite the same, however, because I think this way would allow villa skip... perhaps the wording would look something like "can't do a screen transition while outside of normal game boundaries". I still like the idea of image 2 better, but maybe that's just because I have a better grasp on what the rules would look like in that case.

Also I think I just realized how they patched super jumping. You know how you can jump down a cliff while in midair? They don't let you do that in v1.2. That's how they fixed it. Did they know? :O

Offline aulos

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #41 on: March 20, 2015, 01:13:25 PM »
Just to clarify the idea: click here.

it starts to look like my previous idea for "no wrong warp" where you can't transition between 2 spots that shouldn't be connected.

I think the main difference is from the way of doing it. Your idea forbids screen transitions like the D8 to Egg one, as mine forbids the specific ones as in the picture or the Shaq Jump before Flame Fountain.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 03:42:32 PM by aulos »

Offline Drenn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #42 on: March 20, 2015, 06:06:38 PM »
How's this for super jumping http://www.twitch.tv/drenn_thew/c/6364090

Offline LoenP

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #43 on: March 20, 2015, 07:24:23 PM »
made a comparison vid of the ones people have found for DX that may or may not be ruled to be illegal.

https://youtu.be/Jcjw8YwWTIs

Offline Riddler

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #44 on: March 20, 2015, 09:05:18 PM »
Just to clarify the idea: click here.

I think the main difference is from the way of doing it. Your idea forbids screen transitions like the D8 to Egg one, as mine forbids the specific ones as in the picture or the Shaq Jump before Flame Fountain.

I find that this picture says "Let's bend the rules in this specific place because it'll be faster" I personally do not feel that superjumping onto the ceilings in caves should be allowed, as you stated "You cannot exit the bounds of the room you are in" as "OoA".

My opinion is that you should not be able to exit the main bounds of the screen (cannot go completely over walls that have no real ground on the adjacent side[like the one in d6]) This is a tricky subject to figure out and that's why we have to define OoB :p

Offline Flynn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #45 on: March 20, 2015, 10:14:50 PM »
http://i.imgur.com/fnyM2no.jpg

and

http://i.imgur.com/z0cV3jC.jpg

thy flynn has spoken

(maybe seabass will notice me now..?)

Offline SurrealGuy

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #46 on: March 21, 2015, 01:35:05 AM »
According to Flynn's picture of D6, that would allow another Superjump. I just made a quick video of that. This would save about 10-12 seconds over playing Mambo after getting the Nightmares Key.
http://www.twitch.tv/surrealguy/c/6366053
We would have to decide if youre allowed to stand in any wall. Because to me it would make no sense to allow the D6 jump i just posted, but youre not allowed to stand in a wall on the border of a screen (which would also allow the alternate Rooster skip method then).

Edit: Ok, you have to walk on the ceiling for alternate Rooster skip, which is another thing we have to decide.
Edit2: I should read more carefully.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2015, 02:24:35 AM by SurrealGuy »

Offline aulos

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #47 on: March 21, 2015, 02:08:40 AM »
We would have to decide if youre allowed to stand in any wall.
Read my post on the first page of this topic, it might lead you to a solution.

Offline Flynn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #48 on: March 21, 2015, 02:42:06 AM »
I'm not a big fan of being able to stand in walls myself, but I'm open to any discussion about it.

Edit: To clarify my position I really like what aullos is proposing, and for the most part it lines up really well with what my idea of OoB is.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2015, 02:48:07 AM by Flynn »

Offline aulos

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #49 on: March 21, 2015, 03:22:52 AM »
Also consider that my definition would definitely allow Walrus Skip for the main category.

Offline LoenP

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #50 on: March 21, 2015, 05:14:34 AM »
http://i.imgur.com/fnyM2no.jpg

and

http://i.imgur.com/z0cV3jC.jpg

Yeah this sums up how I view it. D4 early is neat (and old) but idk about walking on dungeon/cave ceilings.

Offline aulos

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #51 on: March 21, 2015, 07:28:03 AM »
How's this for super jumping
I think it's okay ? I mean, even if you can walk through walls, you can't go to another screen through them and I don't know if it would be worth to get the glitch for that (maybe someone should try to make a route?)

Offline Drenn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #52 on: March 21, 2015, 08:27:10 AM »
I think it's okay ? I mean, even if you can walk through walls, you can't go to another screen through them and I don't know if it would be worth to get the glitch for that (maybe someone should try to make a route?)
FYI this can also be done in d4 and d8 (swimming in lava). It can also be done in certain caves without wall clipping, but it's inconsistent. I dunno... I really think this is just too powerful to allow, even if we have all these other restrictions in place. It's just really silly.

And for the record, I agree with flynn and everyone else, about the boundaries restricting cave ceilings, I think this makes the most sense.

As for walrus skip. Yes aullos's rules totally allows for it. If there's still going to be any debate over whether it should be allowed, it should be on the basis of banning deloading, instead of trying to warp the OoB definition to say that walrus skip isn't allowed. Not that I personally think we should ban deloading.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2015, 08:34:56 AM by Drenn »

Offline oseabass

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #53 on: March 21, 2015, 02:19:16 PM »
http://i.imgur.com/fnyM2no.jpg

and

http://i.imgur.com/z0cV3jC.jpg

thy flynn has spoken

(maybe seabass will notice me now..?)

I agree with both these images.  Ship it boys.

Offline Flynn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #54 on: March 21, 2015, 03:54:15 PM »
If anyone has any specific jumps that they've found and are not sure if they would be legal by this new ruleset feel free to post them here. Even if we have to rule on these one by one it wouldn't take too long till we have a very concrete list of what is allowed and what is not.

I have to say tho, I'm liking the direction this is going. I feel these are really interesting additions to the route. It's been a really long time since ive been excited to watch a dx run, but im real pumped to see what happens in the next week or so.

Offline oseabass

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #55 on: March 22, 2015, 06:42:58 AM »
Forgive me in advance for the length of this post, but I will try and explain how I think the rules should be laid out to allow/disallow what we want.
Sorry in advance for the complexity of this post, I blame my math/programmer/proof background, also I apologize for my lame MS Paint Skillz.

I am also going to explain how the game is programmed in terms of tiles, so that could be VERY confusing to some people.  If you want to get right to the "rules" skip down to the big RULES ARE HERE section ;)

*clears throat* Ahem *clears throat*

First I will start by defining "tiles".  Tiles are the basic level building mechanic in LA(dx).  Each screen is made up of a grid of tiles that is 10 across x 8 tall.  Take for example this room in dungeon 8 where one gets the fire rod,

If you break it up into a grid, think of it like a chess board (not square) with the bottom left corner being A1, bottom right corner J1, top left A8, top right J8.  You can also think of it like a plot on an X,Y graph if you want with tile (1,1) being in the bottom left, (10,1) bottom right, (10,8) top right, (1,8) top left.  I will be using the "graph" style notation since it's easier to deal with numbers then letters ;)

 For a better grid look at how BGB splits it up when you view the VRAM, each 2x2 box counts as one "tile", but take note that this shows one extra row down to account for when the screen is transitioning.



The way the game is coded, looking in the debugger of an emulator you can see this grid laid out in RAM by looking in the rows/values of F700 through F790.  The grid is surrounded by "FF" which is the highest hex code value that can fit in those spaces (or what the developers used as a buffer).  Each tile is programmed/painted onto the screen using a corresponding hex code to determine the properties of that tile.  For instance in our D8 room, the walls/look/art/hit detection/interaction/everything is the same on the wall squares.  If we look at the very top row (row 8) we see the following tiles from left to right: C0, 25, 6 x 21's 26, C0 (10 across).  These hex codes map directly to a tile and how it works: Eyeball Statue, TopLeft Corner D8 Wall, Top D8 Wall x6, TopRight Corner D8 Wall, Eyeball Statue.  These values are used throughout the ENTIRE game because that is how the code is attached to them.  For instance look at the down stairs at (3,4) with a hex code of BE, in every location in the game a down stairs is represented in memory with that same BE code.  I could paste a bunch of screen shots showing this but that is crazy tedious so you just have to trust me on this one or check it out yourself :)

These codes are what give Link the ability to act within the tiles they represent.  Tiles that the game wants Link to move on have those properties.  Walls the game wants Link to not move through have that property.  Trees in the overworld... you get the idea.  The tiles in dungeons are special versus the ones in the overworld, which explains a bit why the super jumps work in dungeons and not in overworld (most of the time ;)). 

In our D8 example look at the walls that act as "northern" walls represented by "21" in the hex code, you see them at the top row 8, you see some of them in row 5, some in row 2.  Since the game is built in dungeons so that these walls can normally be "hopped down" the programmers re use the coding for the high walls the same as low walls, so the wall at (2,2) (3,2) has the same properties as (2,5) through (5,5).  The programmers wanted Link to be able to drop down those ledges to make it to the lower sections.  This allows super jumps off the top most wall in row 8 because the programmers lazily used the same wall code (for look and feel and ease of coding) with the same hex value as the walls in row 2 and 5.  This is why Link can super jump off certain tiles.  In most dungeons the programmers used this same method since a lot of the dungeon puzzles involve dropping down to lower sections.  In the overworld they shut everything off a lot more by making it blocked off a lot better with more varying codes.

I could go into a lot more detail and proofing of this, but for now I'll get to the good part.  If anyone wants me to do a more legit and full breakdown of this I could gladly do a big pastebin/write up for all the tiles, properties, etc. with more examples.  Feel free to PM/message/skype/etc me with questions and clarifications on this.

RULES ARE HERE

Using the D8 grid as a quick example then I'll show other examples further down...


  • Link is allowed to move within tiles that the game "normally" allows
  This means any normal tiles the game wants you to walk on (ground, stairs, ladders, orange crystal blocks) {(2,1) (3,1) (5,1) (7/8,1) (5,2) (7,2) (8,2) (9,2) (2,3) (3,3) (4,3) (8,3) (2,4) (3,4) (4,4) (5,4) (7,4) (8,4) (9,4) (7,5) (8,5) (9,5) (2,6) (3,6) (4,6) (5,6) (8,6) (3,7) (5,7) (6,7) (7,7) (8,7)}
  • Link is allowed to move within tiles that are "+1/-1 Adjacent" in the X or Y direction away from "normal" tiles.
  This is the crux of the rule which allows super jumping.  This means any tile that is directly adjacent to a moveable "normal" can be walked in/on/through/etc.  In our D8 example it is easier to say what is not a "+1/-1 Adjacent" since a lot of tiles are.  The D8 room tiles that are NOT +1/-1 (or "normals"): (10,1) (1,2) (6,3) (10,3) (1,5) (10,6) (1,7) (10,7) (1,8) (2,8) (9,8) (10,8).
I'll so better examples below of this later.
  • Link is not allowed to transition/move/exit screens while within a "+1/-1 Adjacent" tile.  Entering from one is OK!
  This makes it so tricks like super jumps cannot be abused to break caves, dungeons, and such wide open in terms of movement in weird ways.  This keeps all super jumps in check, and also allows for internal tile movement within a screen allowed by rules (Walrus Skip, Hookshot Damage boost throughs, etc.)



Let's take a look at another example.  In Dungeon 4 we find this room.  Link can move around in this room at will on normal tiles and tiles outlined in blue, but not allowed to move on red tiles.  Link is not allowed to transition screens while within a blue tile.  This means if there was in theory a jump that allowed Link to move from the bottom section, jump over the gap of red, to the top with the stairs... Link could exit the room from the "normal" tiles in the top left NOT EXITING FROM A BLUE TILE.

 
I'll finish with one final example in the overworld, up near where Flame Skip occurs.  Again, "+1/-1 Adjacent" tiles are highlighted in blue and the non "+1/-1 Adjacent" tiles are highlighted in red.  The Yellow tiles are ones we normally don't walk to, but Link is allowed to move on them through the normal rules of the game.  If Link were to somehow make it to a yellow tile, Link would be allowed to exit this screen to the left through that small window (NOT EXITING FROM A BLUE TILE).  If Link manages to do this, the next screen over would boost him to the left and past the rock wall he normally could not pass similar to Villa Skip. This would be allowed, since the movement/exit/transition of the screen happened within a valid "normal" tile.  If Link were to exit the previous screen from an invalid tile, this move is illegal.  This still allows Villa Skip within this rule set, since Link can jump into the pit that is above the skip, which makes it a "normal" tile.  Link is transitioning from a tile that he can MOVE on.  I say MOVE here because it is important to note MOVING does not mean WALKING.  Link can jump to move in the Villa Skip example.

Enjoy  ;D
-amBASSador
« Last Edit: March 22, 2015, 07:04:10 AM by oseabass »

Offline Drenn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #56 on: March 22, 2015, 09:05:48 AM »
Cool post bass. The one thing I'm not clear on is the yellow zone. So, we're allowed to walk on any tile which has walkable properties, even if it's normally inaccessible without some kind of glitch? To be clear, this would allow the super jump to reach d4 faster. I'm okay with that, just trying to make sure we're on the same page...

edit: actually, I don't see any reason you can't screen transition while in a cave ceiling with these rules, if they count as a "yellow" zone. So wouldn't this allow for old walrus skip?

Quote
Let's take a look at another example.  In Dungeon 4 we find this room.  Link can move around in this room at will on normal tiles and tiles outlined in blue, but not allowed to move on red tiles.  Link is not allowed to transition screens while within a blue tile.  This means if there was in theory a jump that allowed Link to move from the bottom section, jump over the gap of red, to the top with the stairs... Link could exit the room from the "normal" tiles in the top left NOT EXITING FROM A BLUE TILE.
Wait, so we'd be allowed to jump over these red tiles? For some reason I feel like that defeats the purpose of saying they're restricted. However, unless we allow that noclipping glitch, I don't see where this would be relevant, anyway.

I haven't thought about this a great deal yet, however... I feel like the routing would look pretty similar if we dropped the whole +1/-1 thing and allowed movement through whatever walls, the only restriction being "you can't transition while in a wall". Maybe I'm missing something though. Nvm cave ceilings
« Last Edit: March 22, 2015, 10:35:31 AM by Drenn »

Offline oseabass

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #57 on: March 22, 2015, 10:17:10 AM »
edit: actually, I don't see any reason you can't screen transition while in a cave ceiling with these rules, if they count as a "yellow" zone. So wouldn't this allow for old walrus skip?



If you look at the D4 early cave it would be colored like this.  I am not familiar with the old early walrus skips, if you have a video I can look at it and see how my rule set would apply to it (or not).  The Yellow is basically a fancy way of bringing attention to areas for people for easy reference :).  In this above example, you could say Yellow is anything "normal" moveable, which would be everything NOT blue or red colored.  If you can post a video of old WS I can check it out and get back to you.

Offline Drenn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #58 on: March 22, 2015, 10:22:46 AM »


If you look at the D4 early cave it would be colored like this.  I am not familiar with the old early walrus skips, if you have a video I can look at it and see how my rule set would apply to it (or not).  The Yellow is basically a fancy way of bringing attention to areas for people for easy reference :).  In this above example, you could say Yellow is anything "normal" moveable, which would be everything NOT blue or red colored.  If you can post a video of old WS I can check it out and get back to you.
I guess what I'm trying to say is, why is the cave ceiling colored red while that area in the other image is colored yellow? What's the difference?

Can't find a video for old walrus skip atm, all I know is it's done by transitioning down on one of those 2 screens in the cave.

Offline Rapid_

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #59 on: March 22, 2015, 11:35:28 AM »
...yellow is anything "normal" moveable...
What do you mean by "normal"; do you mean what was and is intended by the developers, or what you defined as "normal" in your post regarding the rules? If it is the latter then it would be perfectly fine to walk around on those tiles as they are used in other caves.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2015, 11:56:26 AM by Rapid_ »

Offline Disclude

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #60 on: March 22, 2015, 11:46:34 AM »
What do you mean by "normal"; do you mean what was and is intended by the developers, or what you defined as "normal" in your post regarding the rules?

Yea..I think "normal" should maybe be restricted to areas that are without glitches, and change the yellow example there to red. Just to make sense with stuff like cave ceilings, but that's just my opinion :P

Offline aulos

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #61 on: March 22, 2015, 11:59:34 AM »
Here is the old Walrus Skip done by Flynn: Link.

Also I think Bass' idea kinda describes mine, as the +1/-1 adjacent blocks are the boundaries of the "Area".

And I'm okay with the Flame Fountain Skip. I mean, maybe the yellow thing can be disturbing compared to ceilings, but let's just say ceilings are ceilings and normally unreachable walking tiles themselves.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2015, 12:12:37 PM by aulos »

Offline oseabass

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #62 on: March 22, 2015, 06:58:07 PM »
I am ok with making the yellow in the previous post all red and off limits.  Either that or making the cave ceiling yellow as well.  As long as we are consistent.  I think the more important thing REGARDLESS of walking on cave ceilings or not, is the restriction to not transition/exit a screen from within a red area anyway.  We are at this point figuring out a small tweak to the rule, which is the argument of:

1. Allow Flame Skip Skip and D4 Early skip.
2. Don't allow either.

I think it is safe to say they are combined together at this point in terms of rules stuff.

Offline Flynn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #63 on: March 22, 2015, 07:10:16 PM »
I personally would not allow either. Although at the moment this is based on being against early d4. I havent put a ton of thought into it but instinctively i do not like flame skip 2.

Typing on a phone fucking sucks.

Offline captain_mop

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #64 on: March 22, 2015, 08:30:33 PM »
With this new ruling, would the new rooster skip be allowed? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqZC3yZJPkQ

Offline Flynn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #65 on: March 22, 2015, 10:25:59 PM »
I believe the last jump that lands link on the ceiling tile beside the cracked ground would render this trick illegal, but could be wrong and have not slept for a very long time so i will defer and wait for seabass.

Offline Drenn

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #66 on: March 23, 2015, 10:35:11 AM »
I personally don't have a problem with walking on the ceiling in d4 or the alternate flame skip, aside from how we're going to word them in the rules. If you allow screen transitions in the "yellow" zone (flame skip), how will you prevent people from transitioning in cave ceilings (old walrus skip)? It would probably be easier to just mark them as red zones, in the interest of not complicating the definition further than it is already...

Offline Rapid_

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #67 on: March 23, 2015, 02:16:56 PM »
Yes, I would see it a good idea to mark the ceiling red as marking it yellow would bring controversy regarding all ceilings. However if we were to mark them yellow, we could say that Link cannot transition screens while within such zones which should allow for even more non game-breaking tricks(and a super RNG based walrus skip like before ;) )

Offline LoenP

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #68 on: March 23, 2015, 09:53:33 PM »
So, without speaking for anyone but just seeing the progression of the thread and seeing discussions in skype and chats on this it seems fairly sure that way a large portion is leaning towards something resembling flynn/aullos/seabass' proposed rulesets. This would also very likely legalize Walrus Skip as OoB within screens wouldn't be a thing anymore and I do agree with Drenn in that if you want to argue towards outlawing it doing it on the basis of targeting the despawn glitch is the way to go from here on.

But the main thing I wanted to ask is given all these being allowed, does anyone feel at this point assuming SJs + WS are in, that a legacy category may be warranted? The current route with all of this is beginning to look very, very different from runs of the past even as recent as giuocob's 1:14:33. Is a split here justified? This would be the most significant change LADX has had in all all the time I've been playing, and I've been here for 1.5 years.

Offline SurrealGuy

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #69 on: March 23, 2015, 11:15:30 PM »
I wouldnt mind keeping the old route or the even older one with Kanalet Castle as a legacy% (and/or create a glitchless route).
For the new route, I would ditch the OoB term completely and just call it warpless% (like LA and allow everything that would be allowed in LA).
I think Leon said, that "OoB" on the screen itself doesnt matter anymore, so that would allow the alternate rooster skip, early D4 and the superjump that lands in a wall i found in D6.

My suggestion: Keep the old category and just make this one a bit more different/broken.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2015, 04:27:26 AM by SurrealGuy »

Offline ZorlaxSeven

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #70 on: March 24, 2015, 12:03:57 AM »
But the main thing I wanted to ask is given all these being allowed, does anyone feel at this point assuming SJs + WS are in, that a legacy category may be warranted? ... Is a split here justified?

As much as I may or may not want a legacy%, I have no clue we can just create one like this. To me, a true "legacy" category would have Kanalet Castle.

Something.

Offline captain_mop

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #71 on: March 24, 2015, 03:13:00 AM »
If we used tompa's definition of wrong warp (no transition between one cave/dungeon to another cave/dungeon), we could just get rid of oob. the categories could look something like:

Nosqww: new category allowing super jumps, flameskip 2, new rooster skip, early d4, but ban old walrus skip.
Nosqwwoob: current category stays the same.
Any% No doghouse: what the current no ww route is.
Any%: unchanged

As much as I may or may not want a legacy%, I have no clue we can just create one like this. To me, a true "legacy" category would have Kanalet Castle.

I agree.

Offline oseabass

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #72 on: March 24, 2015, 05:21:01 AM »
With this new ruling, would the new rooster skip be allowed? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqZC3yZJPkQ

To Quote Flynn:
I believe the last jump that lands link on the ceiling tile beside the cracked ground would render this trick illegal...


This is correct.  It is legal up until link jumps on the ceiling tile and moves around there.

Offline oseabass

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #73 on: March 24, 2015, 05:32:26 AM »
I don't know how I feel about the idea of a Legacy% yet.  There is some merit the the run at this current state seems very "clean", but then again something about super jumps don't seem that "broken".  I think we go without Legacy% for now, as it will clearly split the community up a lot more then it already is based on the recent findings of Walrus Skip (new) and Super Jumps.  I think as a game we are progressing with finding new tricks and they are great.  I think this is what speedrunning should be, finding stuff, isolating it, perfecting it, using it to beat the game faster.  If we start splitting categories more, what category would the weekly races be?  Would most people start running the new rule set, or stick to Legacy% cus they are used to it?

The super jumps really don't break that much or shave off an insane amount of time.  I think they add a nice flair to the game that the main category has been almost lacking.  A lot of people have shown interest in the game because of these jumps and I think new tricks bring people in... they shouldn't scare people off.  Things change.  Games evolve.  Runs evolve.  People had to learn and adjust to stuff in the past and most of us were not here for the (I speak for a decent chunk of us who have joined within the past year or so).  Fast times are still fast without these skips.  Z's 109 is still insane skill, and even if I shave off a few minutes with SJs I am barely touching his time.  These are easy jumps, not RNG dependent, not crazy skill... just a nice new movement set that we are learning to adapt into the run.

I'll go back to what I have been saying: the jumps in their current rule set (no old walrus skip, no new rooster skip, no early d4) don't seem Out of Bounds using an old outdated term.  Bring in these super jumps, allow new walrus skip, call it Any % No SQ/WW/OoB, run the game, evolve, learn, chill, have fun.

-Bass

Offline LoenP

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #74 on: March 24, 2015, 07:32:04 AM »
I'd actually love that definition of a legacy category even more. Rooster Skip, D4 sequence break maybe. No Richard Skip, bring back trade sequence. Maybe the old rule of no deaths (So buying the shovel?)

I've been wanting and privately planning on toying around with doing runs like this at some point for a while, which was what the route was when I first joined and I miss some of the things you did in it that simply aren't seen in any other run (Trade sequence, 'good' ending, Kamelot)

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #75 on: March 24, 2015, 11:19:25 AM »
So how does this jump rank in the ruling of bass



Offline aulos

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #76 on: March 24, 2015, 12:25:25 PM »
So buying the shovel?
Yeah I miss those times too, getting rupee chests and buying shovel after D2.

Also Kamelot is a very interesting part of the game speedrun wise.


So how does this jump rank in the ruling of bass
I guess it's all good. The only bad tiles are the ones in the corners.

Offline LoenP

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #77 on: March 24, 2015, 10:17:45 PM »
Made new video better in quality: https://www.youtube.com/watch?edit=vd&v=beMrJxAjr6I

did frame counts and posted my findings and logic here: http://pastebin.com/fPHYf2m3

Offline LoenP

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #78 on: March 25, 2015, 01:13:13 PM »
Also some of the runners who haven't done them before have asked how to do them so here's what I know on how to make them work: https://youtu.be/WDImsV5kAdQ

Offline Riddler

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Re: Super Jumping (Big Ups)
« Reply #79 on: March 25, 2015, 01:23:16 PM »
So is super Jumping actually in the category now? or are we still waiting?